From Roga

[zvi]

Roga would like to talk about re-editing and re-writing works for podficcing.

Would readers be interested in editing works for podficcing, whether for content (e.g. sex scenes), length, adding dialogue tags, etc.? Does "permission to record" cover a blanket "permission to adapt"?

How would authors feel about re-writing stories so they are easier to be read or to be understood orally? For instance, if your alien language just isn't pronounceable by human beings, or if you've written something in an experimental, visual structure.

And, Roga didn't ask this, but I would like to know, how would we, as listeners, react to getting a story that was changed from the text? How extensive would the changes have to be for you to want a heads up before you downloaded? Would you want the changes indicated in the metadata or also during the story reading?

Comments

[roga]

First of all, yay for everyone talking about this :-) It's really interesting to hear both what people are already doing (which kind of changes you're making while recording), and which kind of adaptations people think might be acceptable.

Personally, I think that other than the kind of obvious typos and maybe the occasional contraction (wanna instead of want to, etc), which the reader can make by themselves, any other change should come with author permission. I do think that there certain changes one can make to a fic to make it better understood when read out loud, like the example of dialogue tags, or Zvi's example of alien languages, and that they should be run by the author. Or really, there are two ways to do this: 1. The author gives the reader blanket permission to make those kinds of changes as the reader sees fit, which could work if the author trusts the reader, or feels less ownership over the text in other media. 2. The reader marks the changes they plan on making and sends them to the author for approval.

As for sex scenes, I brought up the subject for two reasons:

The first is because specifically for me, at least -- and I do wonder if I'm the only feeling this -- reading porn and listening to porn are two entirely different things, and while I am very comfortable with the former, the latter kind of squicks me. Maybe it's the fact that it feels like I'm not alone (there's someone reading porn in my ear); maybe it's the fact that the atmosphere of a written sex scene is very hard to capture in a way that I find hot in audio. The pacing of the scene is crucial, and hard to transfer to audio; a lot of what I find hot in porn is sounds, grunts and moans and gasps and sometimes just uttered syllables, and I usually find them very awkward in podfic.

The second is for similar reasons, but from the readers' POV. I'm sure, though it's not a scientific study, that there are podfic readers who are uncomfortable reading explicit scenes -- either because the scenes are difficult to do right, or because they're afraid of somehow being linked to it one day from their RL identities. And we can say, fine, then those readers should just restrict themselves to non-explicit fic, but: there's a lot of really amazing fic that could still be amazing if it weren't explicit that it would be a shame to pass up on for just that reason, and besides, the podficcing world isn't so big, and it would be a shame for readers, who might be really awesome, not to record certain fics for that reason.

I'm by no means trying to say that podfics should always be censored or anything. But I do think it would be cool to have that kind of adaptation option, if the author permits it and if the reader wants it -- just to have it floating around in the fannish consciousness that it's a possibility, which is why I brought it up in the first place. I remember there used to be fics that offered PG-13 and NC-17 versions of the same story, back in... a long time ago. It's been done before; it's more tricky with podfic, because of the issue of changing the text that someone else has written (or trying to convince the author to dedicate it time and do it themselves for your reading benefit).

Like I said, I'd love for this to just be an option that's out there for people to consider, both authors and readers. I can imagine it going in a couple of different ways:

*The author rewriting an explicit sex scene into something less explicit, maybe rated R or PG-13, for the purpose of podficcing.

*The reader rewriting the scene in the same manner, with the author's permission and approval of the final product before recording it.

*Maybe even recording two versions of the same story with different ratings, although I'm sure readers probably won't bother.

In any case, fics adapted in such a way should have a disclaimer, both on the downloading page and somewhere in the metadata, saying they've been altered from the original into a lower rating.

There are many fics in which sex scenes are essential. And whether they're essential or not, if the author doesn't want the fics changed then they shouldn't be changed. But there are also a lot of long, awesome, shippy fics that don't have to have explicit sex scenes to be awesome, and I'd love to have them more easily available for the (few? many? I have no idea) like me who'd rather read NC-17 scenes in writing than have them narrated in my ear.

And to answer Zvi's last point: as a listener, I would have no problem whatsover getting a story that was changed from the original text as long as it had the author's seal of approval/permission. I wouldn't want the specific changes indicated in neither the metadata nor the reading; I'd want the change acknowledged in the metadata, but anything beyond that I'd prefer to read in a post online at a later time, if at all.

[podcath]

Hey, this is actually meant as a serious suggestion, not snarky! I have changed fic before for my own reading. Typos that annoy me (or the obnoxious cum!), just things that I didn't like. I might do a find and replace when a character's misspelled and it bugs me.

So I wonder whether it might be a way to get YOUR reading experience? I've seriously considered pulling podfics into audacity and just cutting out the music that annoys me. So, maybe you can do that with stories? If it's just a central scene or two...you could find them and just cut them for your own private use???

[roga]

I could do that, yes, but it would come out choppy; here, I tried to suggest an alternative that would still result in a whole, cohesive story.

As it is, what I currently do is just skip forward when I reach porn scenes in podfics, which I can do in my iPod, and not in the car, and it's, well, an imperfect solution :-) For the sake of others like me and podficcers who might be uncomfortable as well, I thought this option might work.

(Thanks for your suggestion, though :-))

[busaikko]

I'm an author who has posted stories with PG and NC17 versions. I see no problems with this at all, provided there was consent between the author and the reader. However, I would be leery of an invisible pressure on the author to agree to edit her story (otherwise no one will record my fic) and of providing two fic options (PG and NC17) and only one podfic (PG). It would not be that hard to record both, actually, as the PG13 generally relies on the tried-and-true 'fade to black' after some kissing/making out *g* and is therefore simply shorter.

It's interesting your reasons for not wanting explicit content. I was thinking more of people who listen to fic in cars or living rooms, with other family members and friends around listening in *g*